It is tempting to talk about Tennyson, and the other Victorian poets, as artists only, but it is difficult to dismiss the political/social/cultural commentary in the poems. The observations Jared made last week about the working classes in "The Lotos Eaters" and "Locksley Hall" are good examples of the political voice or message in the poetry.
Do you see any other evidence of political or social commentary? Think about all the poetry we discussed.
During our discussion of his poem "The Charge of the Light Brigade," I realized that Tennyson is far more than just a poet. With this poem, he is a politician. This poem is simply remarkable and is my favorite thus far by Tennyson. In the poem, Tennyson says:
ReplyDelete"'Forward, the Light Brigade!'
Was there a man dismay'd?
Not tho' the soldier knew
Some one had blunder'd.
Thiers not to make reply,
Theirs not to reason why,
Theirs but to do and die.
Into the valley of Death
Rode six hundred." (9-17)
The following eight lines are simply remarkable. Through these lines, Tennyson seems to question the war and the deaths of so many soldiers. The poem was written during the Cremian War which started in 1854. The struture of the poem simply mimics a battle field and a scene of war. The galloping of the soldiers in the first standza is just beyond words. The form and content simply fit together. We have even mentioned in class that this is the most patriotic poem of the English literature. We even stated that their nobility is simply to be honored because they do what they are told without question even thoug the general has clearly staired such a large group into the wrong direction. Tennyson wants to soldiers to be honored and more importantly to not be forgotten. At the end Tennyson says:
"When can thier glory fade?
O the wild charge they made!
All the world wonder'd.
Honor the charge they made!
Honor the Light Brigade,
Noble six hundred!" (50-55)
Here he shows us that it is imporant for the English people to remember the bravery of the six hundred solidiers who died without questioning the orders given. This poem clearly illustrates Tennyson's view on politics as he shows the reader that the general and his orders were wrong. To conclude in "Locksley Hall," we can clearly see how Tennyson felt on the issue of social class and the superiority he felt with his skin color. The following lines from the poem all too greatly utters his feelings. He says "Fool, again the dream, the fancy! but I know my words are wild,/But I count the gray barbarian lower than the Christian child." Wow! Tell us how you really feel, Tennyson. He illustrates in this poem that his race is superior to any other race. Further, he even criticises women as he says "Women is the lesser man, and all thy passions, match'd with mine,/Are as moonlight unto sunlight, and as water unto wine - ." Also, it is evident that he believes that he his gender is the dominant one and that women are inferior. I absolutely love his way of putting his true feelings on social and political issues in his poetry. He is the Wordsworth of this era, and I am convinced that he will be my favorite poet of this era. I associate Wordsworth with the Romantic Era and Tennyson with the Victorian Era.
I agree, he does bring racial issues up in “Locksley Hall”. By saying that he would mate with a barbarian woman but the child would not be as worthy as a white Christian child, is so racist! It was assumed in this time that white Christians were the supreme; they were higher ranked than everyone else. These people. And in “The Charge of the Light Brigade” I agree that he is commending the soldiers for a job well done. He is saying that they were noble and honorable for not questioning, but just simply doing what they were told.
DeleteOpinionated reply:
DeleteTennyson's racist and sexist commentary is entirely unappealing. In a way, reading such opinions seemed to expire my enjoyment of reading him, as I often hope to find some kind of personal connection to writers themselves. It just happens from time to time. This isn't to say that I refuse to appreciate their creativity or artistic merit, but it definitely breaks my desire to persue that connection to their character. I try to leave the subject open for interpretation; perhaps the opinions are only to serve the character in the poem, but I have difficulty believing in the effectiveness or tastefulness of its use in that respect.
I also don't feel it is appropriate accept the subject material by falling back on the "way-of-the-times" excuse. The philosophy of equality predates the civilized, English notions of racism and sexism of Tennyson's time and it is safe to assume that writers, poets, scholars, or anyone of education--or STATUS, in Tennyson's case--had access to the literature and/or concept.
I still think that his form, style, and choice and langauge are some how connected to his individual biases.
DeleteDr. Battles,
ReplyDeleteI am not sure as to why it did not indent. I indented it and when it pubilshed, it did not stay indented.
Tennyson's tone in "The Charge of the Light Brigade" was paying respect to these soliders. He was making a political stance by choosing to honor those who went and died by saying it was "theirs not to make reply, theires not to reason why, theirs but to do and die." With this, he is giving thanks to those who were brave enough to take commands when they did not know their fates. He is admiring how brave these people really were.
ReplyDeleteSammy,
DeleteI most definitely agree with the point that you make. He is praising the bravery of the fallen soldiers who perfomed without questions. Yes, they were noble and honorable in more than one sense. Their bravey earns them both honor and nobility, and I think that is just what Tennyson is saying in this particular poem. :)
"The Charge of the Light Brigade" certainly has political under tones that reveal some insight into Tennyson’s own perspective. I think Tennyson chooses to take a side and decides to make clear that it is necessary to acknowledge the soldiers’ noble bravery and loyalty to their country and leaders. The men of the Light Brigade march on despite their inevitable danger. During class some suggested that perhaps these lines were more negative in nature since they alluded to the idea of the faceless s soldier built to die and not question orders. Although a plausible interpretation, I think this specific analysis focuses on the poem through a modern perspective as opposed to one that considers the poem in its corresponding time period.
DeleteTennyson is definitely more than just an artist. He reveals and comments on social and political issues in almost all his poetry. Although he mentions political and social issues he does not pick a stance to defend or attack. In my “Last Duchess” he makes clear the total power authority the nobility posses. The Duke of Ferrara was able to seize all of the Duchess’s smiles by a simple command. In “Soliloquy of the Spanish Cloister,” “The Bishop Orders His Tomb at Saint Praxed’s Church,” and “Fra Lippo Lippi” Tennyson reveals many issue found in a vital part of Victorian Society-- Religion. Tennyson makes clear how flawed the religious leaders, who are supposed to be examples for others to follow, are very much flawed. In “Fra Lippo Lippi” Tennyson reveals that some monks do not choose to become religious monks rather are forced to in order to survive societal hardships. In both “Soliloquy of the Spanish Cloister” and “The Bishop Orders His Tomb at Saint Praxed’s Church” the speakers are more involved in worldly endeavors rather than spiritual salvation. In the latter poem the Bishop is only concerned about the physical appearance of his tomb rather than his spiritual salvation. In the former the speaker is more intrigued with distasteful behavior and catching others in the wrong than abiding by his religious covenant. In “Prophyria’s Lover Tennyson makes mention of sexuality and its role in Victorian society.
ReplyDelete"In both “Soliloquy of the Spanish Cloister” and “The Bishop Orders His Tomb at Saint Praxed’s Church” the speakers are more involved in worldly endeavors rather than spiritual salvation. In the latter poem the Bishop is only concerned about the physical appearance of his tomb rather than his spiritual salvation. In the former the speaker is more intrigued with distasteful behavior and catching others in the wrong than abiding by his religious covenant."
DeleteThis is great!
I appreciate good social commentary against the church, so it appeals me that Robert Browning has used that, though not as extreme or in the direction that excites me more, like, say--Percy Shelley?? But I don't want to veer off into that mess . . .
ReplyDeleteGenerally speaking, everyone seems to take a left-leaning stance of sorts, Robert Browning perhaps further than Tennyson, but yes, even Tennyson.
I am trying to think of why I read Browning as more "liberal," and I'm not sure if I can point to any passage that would explain my thinking here, but I do get the feeling . . .
Perhaps it is within the "edgy" subject matter, or the use of "rebellious" plot lines that involve sexuality or violence or murder. We have much more to cover of the Victorian Era writers for me to place Robert Browning against the spectrum, but he doesn't seem to inject as much of a personal agenda in his lines as Tennyson does (when he does). His use of fiction does seem less restrained, which makes his poems more intriguing, more free, and more agreeable to my taste--
And YES, it is important that you all consider my taste and opinions in forming your own ;)
I apologize for being so sassy on the blog this week--I don't really have an excuse, but it's almost spring break!!
too late.
Deletewhen you used the word "rebellious," Jared, I thought of the word rebel, as in Luke Skywalker as part of the rebel alliance. Plenty of politics in Star Wars, just not in Tennyson's poetry.
DeleteI cannot help but think that the poems that I have mentioned are somehow related to Tennyson's true thoughts on the matters. I also agree with Junita. Tennyson is more than a poet. He is a politician and an active memeber of he social scene. Of course he is going to have his individual opinions and for him that is reflected in some of his poem. Maybe, I did think too much into it, but I do beleive that some sort of a connection does exist between his form, style, and personal opinion.
ReplyDeleteAlright, I'm not really seeing too much political action in Tennyson. "The Kraken" is about a sea beast. "Mariana" is about a woman who is very unhappy that her love is not returning. "The Lady of Shalott" is about a magical woman who probably would like to be with a nice knight, instead she takes on the curse and dies; sounds like a fairy tale to me. "The Lotus-Eaters" (although Dr. Battles and Sir Jared suggest a political angle)is a scene from Homer's Odyssey-- What is political about that? "Ulysses" is about exploring, unsatisfied with being stationary. "Tithonus" is more Greek Mythology, but I think backward a little bit-- still no politics. Alright already! The monologue, "Locksley Hall" does contain some politics-- sexist politics. Tennyson declares, "Woman is the Lesser man, and all thy passions, match'd with mine"/"Are as moonlight unto sunlight, and as water unto wine--" "Break, Break, Break" is about the sea carrying on in usual manner, despite the speakers sadness. Most of the poems in the Tennyson section of the anthology just don't stir up agreement or strife with me-- to take or reject a political side with him! "The Charge of the Light Brigade" bring feelings of national pride to me, not political views. I'm probably stone cold blind, but I'm not seeing it.
ReplyDeleteJim,
ReplyDeleteOn the last blog discussion I tried to point to some places in Tennyson's poetry that have subtle (or blatant, if you must) commentary on class distinction, oppression and reaction. Here, we have discussed topics of racism, sexism, and patriotism. I think the general argument is that all of these topics are political issues mentioned within the poetry that might suggest the author's own political views, take it or leave it. I take it, for there are other ways to tell the general stories, or to convey the general "messages," without even slightly mentioning these issues that are indeed political. I take it that the inclusion of such topics within the poetry implies the author's intent, lest the audience be led to a general conclusion that the condensed format of the poem only suggests the broad/linear meaning of its creative presentation.
Using a example from prose to emphasize my opinionated interpretation, some might argue that there is nothing political about "The Chronicles of Narnia"--that it is merely a fun fantasy/adventure series--while others will argue that it is a religious work and pick through all of its possible analogies. We now accept that C.S. Lewis is Christian, and consciously included religious messages throughout the series, but if we did not know, we can still infer that there is an agenda behind the work that is worth considering (or ignoring). Since religion is a political issue and I am one to search for possible suggestions in creative works, I can place the series against my own opinions to say that I don't find its political (religious) agenda agreeable to my own. At the same time, I can appreciate that it is a great work of fiction and enjoy being carried through the general adventure.
Here's a link to multiple academic papers about C.S. Lewis, so I'm not just spitting out nonsense.
http://cslewis.drzeus.net/papers/
Mainly, my argument is that it is always worth considering an author's politics and deciding where and where not to agree with them. And while reading with this in mind, it is still important to accept the broader context of the work, or the obvious intent.
Cheers!